< Wikipedia talk:Image use policy
It doesn't have to be placed under the GFDL - see Wikipedia:Image use policy - but a statement as to its copyright status, permission, etc., should be placed in the image file (:Image:LeCarreJohn.JPG). - Montréalais
I still am not sure about the conventions about images and copyrights. I had an interchange with user:isis in Talk:Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, and I'm still not sure that a note shouldn't be posted in the talk of the page that the image is used under fair use doctrine. Isis thinks that a better explanation should be given, for people not to be "afraid" of using images. So do I. If this was already discussed and decided, please point me to the proper place AstroNomer 22:38 Sep 6, 2002 (UCT)
I think the best place for such a notice is the image description page. Just something simple, like "Cover of videotape of XXX, used under fair use." or something along those lines. But it should definitely be attached to the image, not the article, so that people who might want to use the image in ways that wouldn't qualify for fair use can see that we specifically aren't claiming that it is GFDL'd.
There's not a specific policy to do this, but I think you're right that there should be. --LDC
I'm going to make a few observations here, and then I have to concentrate on my paying work until 17 September, so I'm not going to be able to participate actively in any discussion in the meantime.
When you think about the issue of using pictures of created objects (including book and videotape covers) in the 'pedia, ask yourself why you think it's any different from making and using pictures of Campbell soup cans. Then ask yourself what the difference is between PathMark's using those pictures in its ads and Andy Warhol's using the cans in his paintings: Why can't Campbell's complain about either use? Why don't those users have to get Campbell's permission first? Are they making money out of their use of the pictures?
The reasons NetEsq is right that there's no reason to put a "fair use" disclaimer in the image descriptions (and my reasons for thinking it's inadvisable) are:
If it's fair use of the image, it's fair use whether we say so or not; if it were not fair use, saying it was wouldn't make it so. We can know only that it's fair use for us, not for anyone who takes it from us and uses it for something else down the line, and they may think our saying it's fair use makes it fair use for them, too, and they might be wrong.
Asking contributors to recite (in the image description) the legal opinion that it's fair use is like asking a kindergartner to sign an affidavit under penalty of perjury -- he'll do it, but he won't understand what it means, and it might make him uncomfortable about the situation, so he won't want to do it ever again. -- isis 7 Sep 2002
I want to use some pics off Boeings site www.boeing.com . The copyright notice is this:
Terms and Conditions of Personal, Non-Commercial Image Use:
The images on these pages are provided subject to the following terms and conditions.
Boeing owns and retains the copyrights in the images except as noted. No copyright license (either express or implied) is granted to the user, other than the right to reproduce the images without alteration for non-commercial, personal use only.
Can I use them for Wikipedia? Adrian Pingstone 17:34 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)
I don't understand? Is the wikipedia:image use policy a condition of use that I am obliged to follow or a suggestion? User:Wei Chin Ho
Okay, someone really needs to clarify this image business. As I understood it, copyright holders retained their original copyright and were allowed to set terms of use for images used on Wikipedia, and only the text was released under the gdfl, since the bottom of each page says, "All the text on Wikipedia," etc., etc. Now I've heard different things in many, many different places, and I've uploaded images under different conditions. The relevant pages are very ambiguous and opaque, particularly to inexpert users not versed in the intricacies of copyright law. Can someone please decide for once and for all what the answer is, and more importantly, post it multifariously in all relevant locations in very clear English? - Montréalais
Boeing image are just free for personal use, not free of rights that mean you can watch them and keep as many copies as you want for yourself. In fact you can do nothing..... Ericd 20:30 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)
In short, nothing that is less old than something like 75-80 years can be uploaded except if you made the photo yourself and accept to release it under the GFDL (or another license compatible with Wikipedia) or if the copyright owner agreed to release it under the GFDL (or another...). Ericd 20:37 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)
You also know why World War I can have a lot of photos.
I still don't understand while photos make such debate. The situation is simple. You write a text it belongs to you, you take a photograph it belongs to you. You can paste text from the 1911 encyclopedia because it has fallen in public domain, you can upload a photography made by Nadar because it has fallen in public domain. You could paste a text from Microsoft Encarta if Microsoft allows you to do this you could also upload a photograph by Helmut Newton if he allows you (you can try IMO you have more chances than with M$). Of course you can also paste any text that is already under the GFDL and upload any picture that is already under the GFDL. Etc... etc... etc.... Ericd 20:59 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)
I'm learning quickly, finding new pages. There are lots of contributors above with very diverse opinions on photograph copyright but I don't see any person signing as a United States attorney. I would like to possibly insert some pictures with biographies. There must be a legal policy set down by whoever owns this web site, otherwise they would be subject to the risk of very costly litigation. Where do I find the legal facts instead of this collection of very diverse opinions? User:JoanB
Copyright rules are essentially the same for text and pictures read Wikipedia:Copyrights. Ericd 15:49 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
Problems arise with several things but the reality is that Wikipedia:Copyrights is written by users, not the owner. With respect to lawyers varied opinions, a lawyer is legally liable for their opinions. Universities, banks, insurance companies, and every business pay for a legal opinion that they rely on. However, none of us as far as I can see is qualified to discuss this. At least not me. User:JoanB
We don't need to be experts we just have to apply the rules. They're adequate to give an encyclopedia licensed under GFDL. Ericd 16:26 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
The GFDL was written by experts. The rule are just requiring to complies with the GFDL. And as we are not expert we should have a very restrictive understanting of the rule. You made the photo it's yours you can release it under the GFDL. You should be aware that by doing that you loose your own copyright. If you did'nt made the photo it's better not to post it here. Ericd 16:44 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
I can't claim to be a legal expert, but after 15 years of working with GNU professionally and talking to lawyers about it from time to time, I have some sense of what's OK and what's not. Lawyers' advice isn't a magical yes/no - sometimes it's a "you can probably get away with this", because there's no law or precedent. One of the advantages of the GFDL is that it's been vetted by real lawyers such as Eben Moglen[?], who is also responsible for the GNU license. Stan 16:47 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
75 years old is OK see http://www.superstock.com/about/copyright.aspx Ericd 16:59 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
This made in 2003 80 years in the USA and 75 years in most other countries isn'it ? Ericd 17:12 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
Holy Cow! You are back where we started and everyone who is not qualified giving opinions. GFDL has nothing to do with copyright infringement, it is the after use granting. But, again, no one here (so far) is qualified or legally entitled to impose their rules. That is why I said that the owner (responsible party) of Wikipedia must have a policy in place. User:JoanB
And you can grant use only for things that belongs to you or to nobody or everybody. -Ericd 17:25 Apr 16, 2003 (UTC)
Making money is a factor in fair use, but it's complicated. You can make money, but you are on shakier ground when you diminish the money-making potential of the original work. You are even allowed to do that, if you're doing a parody -- what you can't do is swipe the essential heart of the original work purely to make money.
ridetheory 1 Feb 2003
A discussion about this is currently underway at the Village Pump. On this note, I'm all in favor of noting when copyrighted work is used with permission, but it makes no sense to declare the fair use of copyrighted work which is being used without permission. Rather, we should just cite the original source and be done with it.
My understanding of the GFDL is that an affirmative defense of fair use of copyrighted materials *IS* inherited by derivative works which comply with the terms of the GFDL. This is because fair use is *NOT* a license to use copyrighted materials. Rather, it is an affirmative defense to a claim of copyright infringement which presumes that a plaintiff has already established his or her prima facie case in a court of law. Moreover, a determination of fair use is not defeated by virtue of the fact that a derivative work is commercial in nature.
In other words, if Wikipedia's use of copyrighted content is fair use, it should remain fair use when it is distributed for profit under the GFDL. If not, we shouldn't be using that content in the first place.
[Note: This is *NOT* a legal opinion.]--NetEsq
Thanks, I think some buzzwords like "tell us what you know" and "avoid paranoia" would be good for the policy statements. I'll figure out some way to reword those (I'm more a law groupie than a lawyer, but I am a writer, so I sould be able to make the legal issues and policies understandable to contributors). --LDC
I have access to some useful images which are copyright. The copyright owner is happy to allow their use on Wikipedia but is not prepared to place them in the public domain: i.e., he is willing to grant unlimited use of the images to Wikipedia, but not to any third party. As I understand the rules, this means that I can't use those images here. Do I have this correct? (Sorry if this has been asked a hundred times already.) Thanks. Tannin 14:22 Jan 10, 2003 (UTC)
Anyone? Tannin 17:51 Jan 11, 2003 (UTC)
IMO we should have some similar text on this policy page (what I and several others have written isn't as clear as the above statement). What say you? --mav
I asked to use the United Methodist Church's cross and flame logo (see www.umc.org) on the UMC article. They would (of course) not license it under the GFDL, but they will allow use of the image on Wikipedia only. Is that violating the GFDL? Would a better solution be to link to the image on their server? Geoffrey 23:42 Mar 27, 2003 (UTC)
Do you see why it's useful to investigate copyrights ?
Ericd 21:12 Apr 18, 2003 (UTC)
It should be verified by photo here is a sample url : (snipped: the URL caused page widening... :-() Ericd 21:25 Apr 18, 2003 (UTC)
Be careful some photos by Karsh have their copyright expired but not all. Ericd 21:38 Apr 18, 2003 (UTC)
If Karsh had children I'm a little bit worried about their mental health. Ericd 21:40 Apr 18, 2003 (UTC)
Moved from Village Pump
Help! Please go to Panavia Tornado and click where it says "Click HERE for a picture of a Tornado GR-4". The picture comes up OK but there is then no way the reader can get to the copyright information except by noting its file name, going to the Image List and clicking on Descr. Clumsy! Should I therefore make the pic a proper Wikipedia page so that the pic can then be clicked on and the description will come up as normal? Thanks Adrian Pingstone 17:37 29 May 2003 (UTC)
Stuff below moved from Wikipedia:Votes for deletion by Wapcaplet 17:32 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
PLEASE NOTE: Because of the below suspicious activity,User:Joe_Canuckis under a hard ban[?]. This alert posted by Rickyrab 11:28 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)
User:Joe_Canuck has been uploading images since he joined wiki recently. He refuses to offer any sources for most of them, or state other than there was no copyright mention visible and its isn't his legal responsibility to establish if they are copyright-free. Repeated requests by a number of users for clarification have met with a refusal to answer, abuse and the deletion of any requests for information from his talk page. In view of this I have been advised to remove the images from their pages and place them here for deletion. (It is worth mentioning for background information that a number of wiki members who have had the 'pleasure' of dealing with this user strongly suspect that he is banned user DW, who like Joe Canuck had a tendency among other things to download images in these areas, refuse to supply source information and get abusive when challenged. When challenged on this accusation, Canuck simply gets abusive.) A small number of images that seem OK have been left in location, mainly album and book covers that I think are OK (if not, please add to here). A notice as to each image's status has been placed on each image page. Given the tendency of the user to delete 'unwanted' information, the image pages have been protected to prevent the removal of the note that states that they are listed for removal and not to be reinserted in articles pending clarification of their copyright status. FearÉIREANN 02:06 19 Jun 2003 (UTC)
The following images he lists as fair use but gives no indication of source, a requirement to protect wiki should any dispute arise over whether they are indeed covered by fair use.
The following image he lists with the questionable justification that it belongs to the Government of Canada as is as a result public property.
IMO we should delete the lot of them. Better to be safe than sorry plus it gives a clear message that coprighted material will not be tolerated.Theresa knott 09:02 19 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Joe please stop going on about the "owners of Wikipedia.org", you keep using that inall your arguments. No-one owns the content of Wikipedia. - fonzy
I have already stated that the measures taken by the person going by the identity of User:Jtdirl, who is not the owner of this site, with respect to the photo images posted by me are an illegal intrusion into my right to use Wikipedia.org and represents a personal act of discrimination and continued harassment directed against me intended to deny me the right to use an open website. Further, the person going by the identity of User:Jtdirl has included the following statement:
I will be reinstating ALL of the images posted by me that were removed by the person going by the identity of User:Jtdirl who is a volunteer user only and someone who has no authority to ban any User at Wikipedia.org. If the person going by the identity of User:Jtdirl wishes to suggest banning me to the owners of Wikipedia.org, he/she is free to do so at anytime. Please be advised that once I have reinstated ALL my legally posted photos, any further unauthorized removal will constitute additional deliberate harassment and discrimination against me. Joe Canuck 13:23 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
From the Wikipedia:Overview FAQ:
Who owns Wikipedia?
So, when you keep referring to the "owners" of Wikipedia, you are talking about you, me, Tim, Martin, FearÉIREANN, and anyone else who contributes. -- Wapcaplet 15:22 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
POSTING COPY HERE IN ACCORDANCE WITH Wapcaplet SUGGESTION: Joe Canuck 15:48 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
What is or is not legal copyright here at Wikipedia.org is not for you or anyone to make an arbitrary judgment on. Wikipedia.org protected itself, it did not mandate users to be copyright lawyers. When a group of users form a cabal to impose their views, that is in fact discrimination and doing it selectively and repeatedly constitutes harassment. A user to Wikipedia is entitled to use the site in accordance with the owners terms -- not yours or mine. There are many "brave" loudmouths who hide behind their non-USA residence who don't worry about harassment because the prime and serious damage will be to Wikipedia.org, not themselves should a provoked user or rights group decide to protect themselves from abuse. In this regard, I find it incredible that you are willing to think that a totally unknown and unverifiable person logged into Wikipedia under any user name they choose can simply say: "I took this photo myself" or "The person who took this photo has given me permission to upload it to wikipedia and you accept it. Mind boggling that you would accept such implausible claims as adequate legal protection. The DMCA was created just so innocent website operators couldn't be held liable for the actions of the uncaring few. Joe Canuck 15:31 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
OK Joe you ke saying you will contact the "owners of Wikipedia.org". Then why not e-mail Jimbo Wales?? I am shore he will agree with me and everyone else that you are wrong. -fonzy
I vote to delete all those things Joe uploaded. Hello, Joe. I'm afraid I don't follow your reasoning at all. If somebody objects to their work being reproduced here, there is nothing stopping them coming and deleting it themselves. For what it's worth, I'm in totally in favour of deleting all copyright violations, not out of respect for the notion of "intellectual property", but because I think Wikipedia should be written (and photographed) by Wikipedians, and nobody else. GrahamN 16:38 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
GrahamN - you are entitled to an opinion but not to judge what is or isn't copyright. Nor do you have the right to impose your unfounded opinions on others. Deleting my legally posted photos violates my right to use Wikipedia as specified by the owners. What if a group shows up here (User:Vikings was called a group, I think?) who think all users should sign an oath to pray to their God? Do you go along, or go away, or argue against it because that is not what the owners intended? And if that small group intimidates others, do you quit? WEikipedia needs users, and the volunteer Administrators had their banning powers removed for a very real reason.
To User: Ms. Knott - Sorry, Ms. knott, but you and I are not allowed to arbitrarily judge. Wikipedia wasn't created to make lawyers out of users nor to create arguments for no just cause. Photos are non arguable, unlike text where there will always be differences. When we usurp Wikipedia.org's rules and impose our personal legal opinions on another, we only insult users and turn them away, all because we "think" or its a "possible" copyright violation. The law doesn't work on "I think" or "gee, maybe", it works on fact. Morality isn't the issue here, otherwise User:JHK would not have left. There are articles tat too, disgust me. (And oh yes, the unchallenged clitoris photo is a copyright violation, in my opinion.) I see you posted an image that you claim you created. The fact is, you cannot prove it. Do you plan to post your full name, proof of identity, full address etc to support your claim? I can assure, Wikipedia.org does not want that and that is why you or anyone can check in under any name you choose. And, it is an absolute fact that copying images off the internet is legal in hundreds of thousands of cases. Are you qualified to judge which photo is or which isn't? Who says Album covers, that studios paid tens of thousands to have designed, are okay to copy? Check the image list. Look at the number posted with no explanation while others make claims that can't be proven. Can you judge one of USER:Jirl's as to whether he actually took the photo, that he is who he says he is, and that he actually owns that photo? He “claims” he took them, but can he prove it? You can't, I can't and no one else her can either. That is why the DMCA exists. Delete one of Joe Blow's and he will demand all labeled as "taken by me" to be deleted because the claim cannot be proven. And how about Image:Espresso.jpg. -- Wapcaplet ? Can he prove copyright? I know a painting of a cup of coffee that sold for $7 million and a photo of an apple that sold for over $200m. As to the morality involved with photos, that is what an open site means can happen if people choose. But, Wikipedia.org is not at risk under any circumstances and they certainly don’t expect you or me to be forced into a legal position we cannot defend. The risk, is when some nutcase starts harassing people. Wikipedia.org must, repeat must, be named as co-respondent in any action(s) against that User. And, there are users here whose sole purpose is to satisfy a need for power that has nothing to do with morality or the law. Support them if you like, but believe me, those kind of abusers with their arbitrary actions and conduct are the real and potentially terminal risk for Wikipedia.org. not a photo that they have no liability for. The reputation of Wikipedia is indeed harmed by gaining a reputation of an illegal cabal harassing sincere users who in fact obey all regulations established by the site owners. You said:
Sweet and simple: You have no right to judge or to create YOUR rules. My photos were posted in accordance with the rules established by the ONLY authority: the site owners, NOT YOU. So, please stop ranting and move on because I am tired of those who wish to impose their views. As I said, delete my photos and you will have violated my rights. I looked at your photos, Arpingstone's, JTDirls, Maverick149 etc. None are proveable as to copyright ownership. And no, there is no such thing as "less" violations or "more acceptables". If you don't like my actions, then ask the site owners to review the matter and, as promised by USER:JIRl, demand I be banned. Also, I remind you for the last time that you should check with the owners before you take arbitrary actions because the consequences could be severe. That is, if you care about Wikipedia.org. And, by the way, I am not some complaining nut who fills up his/her user contribution list by creating meaningless little edits to articles. I back up my words and beliefs in the value and integrity of Wikipedia by doing quality, in-depth articles to the best of my ability. Joe Canuck 17:32 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I agree 100%: "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then don't submit it here." But photos are fixed, unalterable objects that are given a specific legal authorization as an upload by the owners of Wikipediua.org. End of discussion on my part. Joe Canuck 17:44 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Given the history of DW/Black Widow/Joe Canuck in returning to wikipedia even after banning, I think it is fair to presume that the banning of Joe Canuck will not mean an end to the danger that these images may still be used by him. The odds are that he will return in the near future and if the images still exist, reinsert them. To ensure he can't, I would suggest that the image be deleted immediately the seven day waiting period is over, which means that they should be deleted as soon as possible after the 26th of June. A question: given that the user who downloaded them and so knows their source is now banned (and it is unlikely anyone else on wiki will be able to trace their source), do wiki rules allow in such circumstances for their deletion ahead of the 7 day waiting period? As the person who put them here I will not be the person who deletes them in any case. FearÉIREANN 09:24 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I have voted against User:Jtdirl’s statement that the images posted by User:Joe Canuck should be deleted. And I gave the reasons on the Wikipedia:Votes for deletion page. ChuckM 20:08 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Comments below moved from Wikipedia:Votes for deletion by Wapcaplet 21:15 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I have been on vacation and returning today I learned of the ban of User:Joe Canuck. I logged on to Wikipedia because of my interest in sports and because of what I thought was User Joe Canuck’s real good stuff being done on the different years in sports. I read the list above and have some questions about the photos that User:Jtdirl says should be deleted as well as statements he has made.
User:Jtdirl says: The following images he (User:Joe Canuck) lists as fair use but gives no indication of source, a requirement to protect wiki should any dispute arise over whether they are indeed covered by fair use.
My question to User:Jtdirl is: What requirement, and how could there ever be a dispute? If a copyright owner gives the required legal notification to Wikipedia of an infringement, there is no dispute, the photo is removed. It is simple and no big deal and no risk of any kind to Wikipedia who cannot be held liable if someone uploads a copyrighted photo because they have, as User:Joe Canuck, pointed out, registered for protection under the DMCA. By actually reading what User:Joe Canuck said, I can understand his point is that any disputes are by Wikipedia users, all with their own opinion that repeatedly contradicts one another. The discussion pages are filled with hundreds of opinions. And that is a waste of time, involving people arguing unnecessarily that only confuses Users as to right legal policy. I found where User Maverick149 said we are pretty liberal on fair use, User Eloquence gave his opinion, Brion Vibber a different opinion, and so on. User Stan Shebs asserts that stamps are okay to upload, another person says maps are okay, and User:TUF-KAT has loaded dozens of Album/CD covers saying these are fair game for copying. The Epopt says the magazine covers he uploaded are okay to copy. Then, like Maverick 149’s image of Strom Thurmond that he only labelled as: Public Image. I found articles where some photos got a label: Image of the profile of the Roman Emperor Constans from a coin I own.Then the poster at Stop Esso campaign says: Stop Esso campaign leaflet by Greenpeace, Freinds of the Earth and People and Planet. Who says this is not copyright? Can you get permission? I doubt it, because they worry if someone copies and alters it or uses it unfavorably? Another photo lists the information as (Photo of the children's writer J.P. Martin) . Repeatiung the photo title is proof of copyright? And there are lots like that. And, many photos are uploaded by someone claiming they took the photo themselves including User:Jtdirl doing it many times. Who is right in all these claims? User: Joe Canuck's photo uploads are exactly the same as many of these but he never claimed he took any himself. So why are his photos the only ones being questioned?
User:Jtdirl (James Duffy) stated on his e-mail to [WikiEN-l]: He (User:Joe Canuck) systematically downloaded a series of images to wikipedia, many of which may well have been copyright.
Do we delete photos because they may be copright? And if so, who is qualified to make that judgment? And what about all the other mays? I looked at one photo User:Jtdirl) uploaded at the same time as Joe Canuck’s of Glasnevin Cemetery. User:Jtdirl claimed he took the picture(s). I don’t know, but I think I saw at least one or two somewhere on the Web months ago. Should it be banned? Should we just accept User:Jtdirl’s word? That would be a big legal risk wouldn’t it? If we accept his, then we must accept the word of everyone who makes such a claim. All this really makes for the possibility of a lot of abuse because who can prove what? Maybe Joe Canuck took all those photos or they are his inherited property. I have some excellent sports photos of celebrities I took myself at the US Open and elsewhere. Do you take my word, if I post them by simply saying I took them. If so, how do you know if I am telling the truth or not?
And what makes me mighty nervous is that what User:Jtdirl seems to be doing here, is questioning one person, but not others. That was what Joe Canuck complained about so I have to question User:Jtdirl’s motivations. Maybe he can explain why he has not wanted to delete the many other questionable circumstances surrounding photos being posted by others while User Joe Canuck was doing his thing. And for User: Jtdirl to demand all his questions be answered in fact is silly and a contradiction of the openess at Wikipedia to insist that any user is obliged to answer any questions at Wikipedia on any subject. That leaves the door open to masive abuse. Wikipedia was created so you can come here and be free to edit as you see fit. There is no condition that you spend your time answering any question from the thousands of users here.
I took a minute and went through the last 500 images posted. There are plenty uploaded in the exact same manner as those of User Joe Canuck. But, on the person’s page or on this votes for deletion page, I cannot see any one that has been questioned. Why not? User Joe Canuck does seem to be targeted and I note that User:Jtdirl said on this page:
I may be stupid, but how can User:Jtdirl say that without providing proof? I note that Wikipedia owner Jimbo Wales most definitely did not agree with that unproven statement. User:Jtdirl using innuendo seems to contradict common decency, particularly when a he has someone banned who then cannot respond to such remarks on this page. And it was User:Jtdirl who had User Joe Canuck banned on his unproven words to Mr. Jimbo Wales without allowing User Joe Canuck to defend the accusations. Accept photos from some without question but delete those of others uploaded in the exact same manner is certainly questionable conduct. Then to ban someone without trial, making slanderous accusations is unacceptable and intimidation against all users. I see too that User:Jtdirl (James Duffy) also stated on his e-mail to [WikiEN-l] Re: Joe Canuck : When a number of users asked him (User:Joe Canuck]] to clarify their status, he became highly verbally abusive, issued legal threats and then deleted the questions.
I read all of User Joe Canuck’s staements and this statement by User:Jtdirl appears to be a complete falsehood as I found no such abuse or threats of any kind. What I saw was repeated harassment that User:Joe Canuch complained about. What User Joe Canuck did do was point out the possible legal ramifications for Wikipedia if a User publicly uses this website to libel another User. Perhaps I missed it so User:Jtdirl can provide the proof of these statements because if untrue they do cause great risk to Wikipedia and all of us who only want to enjoy working here.
Below are just a tiny few of many photos that have recently been placed in Wikipedia while this matter has been going on. Why were none of these questioned? And with all the differences of opinion, who is right? If I upload a photo to Wikipedia, I don’t want someone deleting it just because they may not like me or for any other personal reason they have. Users photos should not be deleted based on the opinions of a few unqualified people. And, I am certain the owners of Wikipedia who set the rules for uploading photos, are just like the many other websites licensed by the DMCA that are fully protected and risk-free from an actual copyright infringement if it ever occurred. Look at the image details for these:
However, for User:Maveric149's claim to public domain for the [Image:Linnaeus.jpg] at article Carolus Linnaeus, this is what the website states:
And there are lots more uploaded images to consider. I may just be a sports nut who can’t make contributions to nuclear physics but I know what I see. And no, I am not Joe Canuck or any other person in the history of Wikipedia and he was the only guy interested in doing the big job to include sports highlights in Wikipedia. And, in my opinion, something smells. ChuckM 20:06 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)
No, I think you are wrong. What I read, and I did read every single word, is that he says it is not a legal requirement to provide details on photos. Note above from the list, many others including you, Wapcaplet conduct themselves in the same manner as Joe Canuck did and not a word is said. Do you have special privlidges here that the rest of us don't? And just so you understand the law: this site is the property of Wikipedia.org. Open content means if they choose to pay the bills and keep it on the Web, others can freeely copy your contributions. You and I certainly don't own it. Plus, I think User: Joe Canuck tried to help by telling us that if someone sues another User for libel, it means Wikipedia will automatically be named and will be dragged into court and pay lawyers. The lawsuit against Kazaa was against them asking the Court to order Kazaa to release the Users true Id's. If you or I abuse another Wikipedia User we risk dragging Wikipedia into a lawsuit. Post a copyrighted photo either deliberately or in honest error and no harm of any kind can come to Wikipedia. That is indisputable fact. And, I read some things on User:Jtdirl, this guy has repeatly said libelous things to others that are the real danger here. I'm not interested in arguing this. Everyone here can make their own decisions but I'm not going to start picking on one person or make false statements about them that could get me and Wikipedia sued. ChuckM 22:20 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)
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