Encyclopedia > User talk:Zoe archive 12
User talk:Zoe/archive 12
Hi Zoe. I was about to start adding more events to May 27 but just want to make sure you aren't either working on it now or plan on working on it soon. Cheers! --mav
> "MyRedDice has never met a vandal he didn't like"
s/vandal/banned user ? Anyway, I treat most people with a kind of detached amusement, myself included. Must be something in the bitstream. Martin
Hey Zoe. I just wanted to comment that it would be nice if you put some information about yourself on your userpage, as well as your "hands off" statement. You seem to be a very active and interesting user, and I'd like to know more about you. When attempting to understand a character in a story, there are a few basic questions: where did they come from? what are their motivations? I guess I'm curious as to what interests you in the wiki that leads you to contribute so heavily, what your areas of interest and expertise are, and general information so I can get a better feeling for what makes you tick. Although I understand that anonymity is a large part of hanging out on the internet, I've always found it frustrating to be faced with simply a username instead of a face and a history when dealing with people. I also understand that if you actively edit other people's articles, your userpage may draw vandalism; when reading about the vandal Michael, I saw that he had changed your page to list oral sex as one of your interests. Nevertheless, I think it's important to stand up for your identity, and I'd like to know more about you than your frustration. Nelson
Dear Zoe: Hi! How are you? I have a question, I always had this question actually...are you a man or woman?
Ask and you shall receive...anwers that is..lol
Other than that I just wanted to say hi.
Thank you and God bless you!
Sincerely yours, Antonio The Issue Martin
Dear Zoe: It was just a question....Im trangendered and dont have a problem with it. Im just curious to know if youre a boy or a girl...
thanks and God bless
Antonio Im Coming Out!! Martin
Oh, er, what? Okay, Zoe, I apologise for having previously assumed that you were a woman, based solely on your user name. Would you prefer it if we referred to you as a "she" anyway, or should we use singular "they"? ;) -- Oliver P. 11:03 31 May 2003 (UTC)
- Zoe has far too comprehensive a grasp of this beautiful language to ever stoop to a singular they. Zoe has class. Tannin
- What nonsense. Singular "they" is the most beautiful thing in the language. :) -- Oliver P. 11:50 31 May 2003 (UTC)
Did I ever say I wasn't a woman? -- Zoe
- Not as far as I can recall. I just couldn't recall any definitive statement either way, so I was just apologising for making the assumption. I hope that clarifies things. :) -- Oliver P. 15:16 1 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Hallo zoe! thank you for your message - I never said all is pornographic, but this is in the USA
we tried to get rid of some - uwe Kils 04:16 1 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- Zoe, my apology for putting this here but Kils talk page is protected, and I am not a sysop. Perhaps you would do me the favour of putting this on his page please.
- Kils -There has been a huge amount of discussion on that picture. You do not appear to have contributed to the discussion at all. What right do you have to delete material that you consider pornographic without first coming to some sort of concensus with other wikipedians? Theresa knott 10:11 1 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- Dear Zoe, Dear Theresa,
from Uwe Kils ("sailor")Kils 15:21 1 Jun 2003 (UTC)
You know I'm on your side re: Michael. You shouldn't take criticism so personally. Just refer people to Jimbo's mail and proceed as previously. --Eloquence 00:34 2 Jun 2003 (UTC)
The reason I undeleted Conflict (band), as I have explained, is that the page contained three paragraphs of perfectly good writing by somebody who isn't Michael. It wasn't based on something Michael had written, it wasn't an edited version of Michael's text, it was new. I don't think that people who are not Michael should have their work deleted simply because they happen to have worked on the same page as him. If nobody else had edited the page, or if Quercus or somebody else had just corrected a spelling or something like that, I would not have undeleted it, but quite a lot of new and valid info was added. I'm sorry you won't be helping in cleaning up after Michael any more. --Camembert
Zoe, as I hope you know, I am 100% on your side re Michael. I have said so on the w-list and on the deletion pages. Sometimes we have to be careful and subtle in how we deal with Michael, but please do NOT think wiki is against you on this. Many many people agree with you. lol FearÉIREANN 02:27 2 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Me too. You do a great job. Evercat
I left a response for you on Talk:Frottage :) As for not taking it upon yourself to babysit the brats anymore - its about time... I knew the gasket would blow sometime. You took too much upon yourself - forgetting that all you have to do is step aside and people will step up. Congratulations on shaking the monkey off your back - regardless of whether Michael or whoever is still around. - Steeb
I think Michael came from hell. Thats all I have to say. Thats my vote of approval for Zoe against Michael.
Sorry about the confusion according to the NFL record book Tornadoes smith03[?]
Hey Zoe, just wanted to say, "Don't let the bastards get you down!" Don't be so quick to declare everyone's opinions for them... I've been trying to follow the discussions surrounding Michael, because I'm really concerned about the implications of vandalism for the wiki model, and I think that although like any other human with limited time, patience, and energy, you haven't handled some Michael-related situations perfectly, I'm behind you 100%. It's not like you're getting paid to maintain Wikipedia or anything, if only every organization had enthusiastic volunteers like you. Just don't let stupid people get your goat, they're not worth getting upset over... you know that in real life they're losers extraordinaire who spend all their free time watching Jerry Springer. And be optimistic. People tend to live up to their expectations. Telling people that they don't support you makes them less eager to do so. Imagine if your friend tells you, "you never call" or "you're never there when I need you", does that make you feel more friendly? Even if they've been a little lax about calling you, isn't your friendship more important? Don't get too angry with the wikipedians, they're your friends, they want a good wikipedia too. Promote a healthy, understanding community of goodwill, and the wiki will be better able to defend itself against malicious attackers. That said, take a vacation, and post some bad jokes or Beach Boys lyrics or something on your user page instead, leave people with a smile :-) --Nelson (Why do I always end up writing a novel every time I try to say something? Feel free to summarize and refactor, as always)
I'm new to this and don't understand all the conventions. Please explain to me why you removed my note to other contributers from King's Highway (St. Augustine to Mexico) Rich J 22:37 10 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Hey Zoe, thanks for the nice message on my talk page. I will do my best with putting up some of my own *non-copyright* images, lol. Take care. --ManicGypsy
Zoe, ignore Graham's stupid attacks on the Votes for Deletion page. You have plenty of defenders there. (Tim has just come on to support a defence I wrote of you and other have too!) And for what its worth everytime I find Michael creating new pages of bunkum I delete on sight, not merely the text but the article. Other sysops do so too. So chin up and keep up the good fight. (Ok and be careful, DW is back. I sent a message about it on the w-list! lol FearÉIREANN 05:49 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
GrahamN is simply saying that all sysops have to comply with the Wikipedia policy on deletion of articles which are possible copyright infringements, as set out fairly unambiguously at Wikipedia:Copyrights: "If a page consists of nothing but a suspected copyright infringement, then you can also list it on Wikipedia:Votes for deletion. If, after a week, the page still appears to be a copyright infringment, then it may be deleted following the procedures on the votes page." There is nothing about using judgement there: it says to leave it a week. If anyone wants to change that policy, they will have to argue to get that page changed. (I would oppose such a change, incidentally.). -- Oliver P. 05:58 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Sorry Zoe, but it had to go somewhere. VfD was up to 39 KB. -- Tim Starling 07:02 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- I am astounded at the casual attitude that is displayed in so many of the comments that have been posted in this discussion. If this place is to remain truly free and democratic then it is vital that all sysops are accountable to the rest of us, and that real consensus is always demonstrated before any deletion or ban is enacted. If there were a Wikipedia Constitution, these two principles should be in big capital letters in first paragraph. This is a very serious matter indeed. Why are so many people trying to play it down? If I was prone to paranoia I would point out that if a group of people wanted to stage a coup and gain complete control of Wikipedia, then a good way to start would be to spread exactly the kind of complacency that so many users are demonstrating here. GrahamN 15:32 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- "If I was prone to paranoia . . ." If??? This stuff is so paranoid it is mindboggling. FearÉIREANN
- Only deletions that are questionable need be placed on VfD. We can and do differ a bit on just what should be listed and what can be zapped immediately though. Same thing for banning IPs. If we had to discuss each of these before they were done then we would be in trouble. --mav
- What you are telling me is that there is some terrible external threat to us, and the only way to protect ourselves from it is to suspend democracy and give absolute power to an unnacountable clique. This argument seems curiously familiar from somewhere. GrahamN 16:43 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- I'm telling you the way things are. And the dozens of junk page inputed daily and the equal number of vandalisms is a threat to productivity and making sure actual content is behind links instead of "al;kj;ljkl;kje" or "This is gay". If we had to vote on obvious cases then everything would grind to a halt. When was the last time you voted on whether or not to make a change to an article? This is a wiki for heavens sake! Your accusation of there being an unaccountable clique is insulting - we are not a clique since we hardly ever agree on anything and are very accountable because of people like you and ultimately Jimbo.
- Saying from someone he is trolling when he is just exercing his right to speak up and protest is also insulting User:anthere
- Where did I say he was trolling? Please read before you speak. Otherwise it looks like you are being dishonest. --mav
- Actually, she was referring to my comment from above. -- Notheruser 18:51 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- Nod. I was refering to I think you're bordering on trolling. Anyway, the page has been restored, effectively making this a non issue. -- Notheruser 02:31 16 Jun 2003 (UTC), not to anything you wrote Mav. I did not mean to be dishonest. But the place is messy :-) (anthere)
- Anthere, they've had past spats. Please look here: /w/wiki.phtml?title=User_talk:GrahamN&oldid=987954 -- Notheruser 18:35 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
- So ? If someone is having repeatingly pbs with another person, he can repeatingly talk about it. I don't see what is wrong there. User:anthere
- Just look at all the flack Zoe is getting for making this one questionable deletion. If I were her I would have froze the page and I suggest she do that in the future instead of deleting in a situation like this. However since it was the same person who created the page in the first place who was reverting the possible copyright violation notice without comment about the copyright status, then that demonstrates that the person doing the reverting was a vandal posting a real violation instead of legit user who was posting their own stuff from somewhere else or just made an honest mistake. So there is some justification for what Zoe did (although the vandal could then create a new page with the same content so I don't see the point really in deleting vs protecting). --mav 17:45 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Let's start at the beginning... 206.128.13.162 (hereafter referred to as "Gorged") contributions (/w/wiki.phtml?title=Special:Contributions&target=206.128.13.162). Times in italics. Sysop actions in bold.
- 00:46 16 Jun: Gorged created New River Gorge Bridge on
- 00:52 16 Jun: it was correctly replaced by the copyright boilerplate text by Evercat
- 00:53 16 Jun: Evercat lists the page on VfD
- 00:57 16 Jun, Gorged blanked the article.
- 00:58 16 Jun, Notheruser reverted Gorged and reinstated the copyvio noice.
- 00:59 16 Jun, Notheruser tells Gorged on hir talk page to "use the sandbox for testing"
- 00:59 16 Jun, Gorged edits West Virginia (adds an external link)
- 01:01 16 Jun, Gorged recreated an edited version of New River Gorge Bridge
- 01:03 16 Jun, Evercat explains the sitation to Gorged on hir talk page
- 01:04 16 Jun, Gorged makes a minor edit to it
- 01:07 16 Jun, Zoe deletes it
- 01:07 16 Jun, Zoe blocks Gorged from editing Wikipedia.
- 01:52 16 Jun, GrahamN queries deletion
- aprox 02:00 16 Jun Hephaestos (presumably) undeletes the article.
I hope this is off some help to someone. This is reconstructed from logs, etc - hopefully they're accurate. I couldn't find any other Gorged edits except these five - were there any? Martin 18:12 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
OK, comments:
- Gorged seems like a typical newbie. He reinstated the possible copyvio once (it's been incorrectly asserted that he continually reposted it - that's not the case). I don't feel that he deserves the epithet "vandal". Oh, and he did give the source of his text as an external link, so it's not like he was trying to pull the wool over our eyes.
- Personally, I'd have just reinstated the copyvio notice, and possibly left a note on Gorged's page, rather than deleting the article. Others here have suggested additionally protecting the page. I hope that Zoe will follow one of those suggested approaches in the future.
- I feel it was a little premature to block Gorged, based on a single reinstatement of a possible copyvio. I just unblocked him.
- Thanks Evercat! :) Caught a possible copyvio, listed it on VfD, explaining the situation to Gorged on hir talk page. Excellent work, I think - can we have a small ripple of applause for Evercat please! :)
- Notheruser's revert and talk page comment - they're surprising. I actually wonder if the page history has been corrupted, somehow?
- The entire process - from initial posting to the deletion and block - took around 21 minutes. I wonder if a more leisurely approach might have paid dividends.
- I've recently made it a habit to leave "please use the sandbox" on anonymous user's talk pages as a way of "tagging" potential deleterious users and guiding confused users to an appropriate place for testing out Wikipedia (non-deleterious users). It seems to work most of the time (maybe they realize their actions are being "watched" or maybe they just get bored). -- Notheruser 18:46 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Without meaning to sound too dramatic, people who often check Special:Recentchanges are on the front line of a constant struggle against vandalism and the like. Without them, Wikipedia would soon be flooded with nonsense. But since there are so many edits, snap judgements have to be made, and mistakes are going to occur. This particular instance does not seem to be particularly serious. Evercat 02:50 17 Jun 2003 (UTC)
hallo zoe, hallo Martin! regarding:
Are you releasing copyright of these images you are uploading to Wikipedia? If so, then why do you need to say they're copyright by you? If not, they can't be here. -- Zoe
- yep, yep - it'd be good if you could add something like "released under the GFDL" to the image description page, just to clarify... Martin
yes, of course are we giving you the rjight to use our images, this is legaly done by clicking the "uplead" bottom. Heep up with your fine work! we will help you - we are not the Vandals you think we are - Vikings 23:01 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I think my position on this particular "discussion" is easily discernible. :) -- Notheruser 03:05 17 Jun 2003 (UTC)
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